Local Listens #15: Aseurai: Phoebe Rings’ First Date

LOCAL LISTENS | COLUMN | RONGOA / DRUGS

Interview by Liam Hansen (they/them) | @liamhanse.n | Editor-in-Chief

Interview with @phoeberings

Liam speaks to Phoebe Rings about their album Aseurai. 

Liam  

Right! I think most people within the Auckland scene became aware of you guys around 2022 after the EP came out, - that's when I did, at least. How long had the group existed before that point?

Crystal  

We had our debut show February of 2020 - Right before the lockdown, of course. 

Liam  

Did it start up as a solo project, or were you already getting everyone involved?

Crystal  

Yeah, it was more of a solo project, I guess, but it was more like...

Alex  

It was. You can say it, it's okay.

Crystal  

[laughs] Yeah. It was a band playing the songs I wrote. 

Alex  

And most of it was arranged by you. You wrote up a lot of the parts  and had a pretty good idea of the sound before.

Liam  

All of you are across various different bands across Auckland and the country. Was Phoebe Rings your first main project, Crystal? Or did you have other various things before? 

Crystal  

Oh, I had a jazz 10 piece project called Skogatt, and that was more chambery. 

Liam  

 Were the others in that band, or was it just generally around Auckland music scenes that everyone met?

Crystal  

Yeah, we're such a small scene that we kept bumping into each other at gigs and watching each other play. Simeon and I had very briefly both been in Princess Chelsea, and Simeon still is. I was also in Alex's band, A.C. Freazy.

Liam  

Sounds like the usual cross pollination - every band is just made up of the same 10 people in different combinations. So, how long was the production of the EP initially that came out in 2022?

Crystal  

So, the EP originally came out at the end of 2021, before we re-released it last year. That would have taken a year and a bit, year and a half or something. It was during lockdown, so we did it in a very lockdown style where everyone recorded their own parts remotely, and then we combined it together. And Tom Healy at the Lab Studios worked on it as well and mixed it together really nicely.

Alex  

And there's one track, Oceans, that was recorded live at The Powerstation.

Liam  

I mean, I think that the EP immediately did well within Aotearoa, simply because you are all talented, long-performing musicians who have the skills to be able to put together an EP that's immediately quite good without having to find the sound too much. Did you go into writing the EP with a particular goal in mind, or was it basically just like "These are the songs I've written. Phoebe Rings will be the name for how I release them."

Crystal  

I had a couple of songs that I had written over the last three or four years, but- 

Alex  

But you had a couple of songs you played with Skogkkat, with the 10 piece jazz ensemble. Why did you want to change it to a more indie pop sound? 

Liam  

You're taking my job! 

Crystal  

[Laughs] Well, there actually was a song that I had a as a demo, but I had never released it because it was too in the Skogkkat world, a bit more chambery. I mean, Skogktat was my project until then, but there always were songs that I'd written that didn't really fit into that genre. And I thought, "Ah, this does much better in a more indie rock pop world", which I became a bit more drawn to after I'd been on some tours with other artists. When we formed the band of Phoebe Rings, I wrote some more, thinking of you all in mind. So it was a mix of pre written songs and songs that I'd written like when I called the band.

Liam  

 So then, would the album have been all songs that were written with the band in mind? 

Crystal  

There was one, 'Playground Song', that was written around the EP time. But other than that, everything was written, not just since the band was formed, but it was actually written by all of us.

Liam  

Yeah, that's what I'm leading into, because I was re-listening to the album on the way in, and it's just  paramount how much the bands influence grew from the EP. Maybe that's just because there were more voices on it than just Crystal, but even then, I think there are maybe one or two that you're the only vocalist on, and then everything else has at least one of your voices in the background.

Alex  

[To Crystal] You that did all the BVs for the EP - did you originally do all the BVs for Aseurai, and then we added our own ones? 

Crystal  

 I think I did guide vocals, but the idea was to have all of us.

Alex  

But it was a conscious decision to be like, "We don't have to have a chorus of crystals now, we can put ourselves in." 

Liam  

There's a couple of songs that are both on the album and from the of EP era - I feel like I've seen them in multiple states. I think both Aseurai and Mandarin Tree were released as singles, and then went down as there was the carpark switch. Every time that I listen, I try to pick out like slight differences in the new versions.

Crystal  

I don't know if there are differences in the recording?

Liam  

Really? On 'Aseurai', at least, I feel like the the strings there are much brighter and louder.

Alex  

Oh yeah, could be a mastering thing. I think after we got the first one back, it was like, wow. 

Simeon  

From it being recorded, we were listening to it like, "oh yeah, this is a great song." And then hearing the mix and being like, "oh, whoa, fuck, this is a GREAT song." Hearing the hearing the master is like, night and day.

Liam  

I'm curious about what the songs that you two (Simeon and Alex) worked on were, because the only one that I know for sure is that alex wrote Mandarin Tree.

Liam  

Yeah, I wrote Fading Star as well. 

Alex  

I did Drifting and Goodnight, the last song.

Liam  

That makes sense - I was listening to Drifting and trying to figure out which voice it was in the background.

Crystal  

 Yeah! It actually has all four of us in the bridge.

Simeon  

Yeah, I think we made a conscious decision - I definitely brought it up, to not make it a Fleetwood Mac situation where everyone sings lead. Crystals gonna sing lead, and then Ben has his song, obviously. But other than that, you two share on Mandarin Tree and we share on Drifting. So there's some like, kind of heavy backing vocals that we do, but we don't take any lead in the album. 

Crystal  

I do like how there are some duet moments.

Liam  

Get Up, especially. I do feel like it's mixed in a very full band way, where a lot of the vocals don't feel like backing vocals. Everything feels very balanced out, and it's so much more of a collaborative work between the four of you, which is actually something I'm curious about, Crystal, if it felt weird to hand over parts of the project?

Crystal  

It was the most liberating thing ever. Honestly, it was the best decision I've ever made. Everyone has such amazing, slightly different to each other tastes. It's so fun to witness it coming into thePhoebe Rings world. Seeing other people write other tracks of the album in their own way, and  layering things on top of that was so fun.

Liam  

I mean, it broadened out the sound from the EP,to the LP immensely.  I feel like the jazz side of things came through a lot more in the EP, and this time it's more shared across the board, of city pop, bits of jazz, bits of electronic synth bits that come in here and there. Did you give any guidance of what a Phoebe Rings song should be?

Crystal  

I don't think I've ever told the band exactly what sound I wanted. But I think I do remember Simeon and Alex talking about how writing songs for Lucky Boy or A.C. Freazy would have been a bit different, like they did have Phoebe Rings in mind, maybe having the EP as a bit of a sound template. But I definitely didn't want to specify  what that was going to be, because that's gonna kill the creativity. 

Liam  

What was the approach on both your ends for those tracks, Alex and Simeon? Did they start immediately as Phoebe Rings songs?

Simeon  

 I have a folder in my Dropbox  for Phoebe Rings demos with a really, really bad filing system that's like, "idea one, idea two, idea ethree". There ended up being ten ideas which, as I felt things were progressing with other people's songs, I went in a specific direction of what ideas I wanted to look at. My personal philosophy for the album was writing songs that didn't exist on the album, if that makes any sense - like, I really wanted to write the last song on the album. I felt like I had gained a lot more of an appreciation of pop music in the years we were recording, and I  thoguht it'd be nice to write a sparkly pop tune. So I was deliberately looking at what the others were doing, and not trying to leave that world, but fill it in a little bit more. 

Liam  

Did that pop understanding come from the time that you've spent in Princess Chelsea?

Simeon  

I mean, that definitely is a big help, because she is such an amazing example of writing a really fucking good pop song. If you just broke it down, they have such an interesting arrangement and stylistic sound. So that has been more of a inspiration than an influence, because I don't think I could ever do what she does, but it's nice to look at examples of people writing really good pop music.

Liam  

On your end, Alex?

Alex  

 I think I find it easier to write for Phoebe Rings than I do to write songs myself. I get really sick of hearing my own voice, saying my own thoughts. And I think it's really nice thinking about things that sound good in Crystal's voice. 

Crystal  

Have you gotten to a point now where there's much difficulty in coming up with parts for Phoebe Rings, or figuring out how to kind of approach songs individually, as a group?

Simeon  

There's certainly no throwing chairs across the room.

Alex  

There probably could be more throwing chairs across the room (editors note: Otter.ai doesn't have a great option for transcribing interviews, so it suggested "throwing chairs" as an action plan for Phoebe Rings to take into future rehearsals. Thanks, Otter.AI!)

Crystal  

I think all four of us are very polite. And sometimes that can make you feel a bit like "are they really digging my idea?" But for myself, a lot of the ideas that all of us come up with are very tasteful. So I can pick if they have options, which one is more to my taste. But yeah, in our arrangement sessions were a bit long - spanning four months, which I would say, is a very thorough and long process, but it paid off. 

Alex  

Normally, whoever's song it was would lead the production of the song, if they had ideas or something sorted already, and everyone else would kind of chip in, but it would be up to that person to ultimately make the call.

Liam  

Had the songs changed much as they went along? 

Alex  

Yeah, they all have. I think that they've changed more now live, which is literally really exciting about moving forward.

Crystal  

Totally. I did have a listen to Aseurai when I first brought it to the band, and it's very different to how it is now. It was much faster, and it was less dreamy and more city poppy, but we kind of made it a bit more Phoebe Rings through our arrangement, which I like much more.

Liam  

Where did the city pop side of things come from in this record? It feels like it was the main new influence that made it's way in. 

Crystal  

Mmm, I think it's an old influence! We all listened to a little bit of city pops starting the band, and when we were trying to feel out what each other liked, we did drop a lot of city pop songs in there, and it's a bit of a common thread for us. I personally would like to move out from it, because city pop can be a bit of a label that. It can be limiting in a way, because it is a style from the 80s.

Simeon  

And I think there'll be some Die Hard city pop fans, that will be probably disappointed, I feel like we do it in a way that is so us. I think it's like good that it's not too to the book.

Crystal  

in order to be like, REALLY city pop, it needs a very lush brass section, which only possible to afford in thebubble economy back in the 80s in Japan. 

Liam  

I mean, even in the recorded material there were so many extra instruments that were added like violin parts and cello parts. Would you ever do a gig, or a series of gigs where you brought in a couple more members? 

Crystal  

We have done it in the past. In 2022, um, we had four string players, two violinsts, two cellists playing the string parts. And it was really fun. 

Alex  

And a harp!

Simeon  

I'll tell you what,  if NZ On Air changes their newly minted touring funding to include bands that don't get project funding, we will take strings up and down the country, I promise you.

Liam  

I think I remember your clip from the Mt Noise podcast a while ago where you were talking about the Omnichord, and figuring out if there was any way to take it on tour.

Simeon  

It's so funny, because I lent mine to Chelsea who was messing around with some new songs. And then I got a message the other day where she was like "oh yeah, I bought one."

Crystal  

I mean, if it's brand new, it's probably is more reliable to take on tour!

Simeon  

Yeah, but $800. And it's another thing to - sorry, I interrupted. [All laugh]

Alex  

Strings, yes. Very yes.

Liam  

I mean, each of you, particularly Simeon, seem to have hubs of so much different gear that's on stage as you're doing Phoebe Rings shows.

Simeon  

Yeah, there's been some fun things that have come and gone that we'd love to bring back. I played lap steel for some shows, I played pedal steel for the Live Music Bar, it is just striking the balance of another suitcase being $400 each way.

Crystal  

Oh my God, on our tour that has happened recently, buying another 23 kilogram bag is so expensive. It's like 300/400 per bag.

Simeon  

And like, we all had the time of our lives on the tour we just did. We got our statement back of what we made on that tour, and it wouldn't cover an extra bag going to Japan, from Japan. 

Simeon  

You'll know we've made it when we have one extra instrument on stage. 

Speaker 1  

That was the Asia tour, yeah? How was it in general.

Simeon  

I don't believe that it happened still. I was over there, and I was calling my boyfriend, and I was like "I'm looking at it right now, and I don't believe that it's real."

Liam  

Is that the first time that any of you have played there? 

Crystal  

I have played in Korea once with Princess Chelsea and Jonathan Bree. That was really fun, but it definitely is a different feeling when you are there with your band. Especially for me, because I come from Korea, to be able to speak in your own language, your mother tongue, to a Korean audience is very special. And I think there is a very special connection when you say "I am from Korea, I live in New Zealand, but I'm speaking to you in Korean right now!"

Liam  

Did Korean audiences take those shows well?

Crystal  

Yes! They're so respectful and lovely. They kind of respond like kindergarten kids speaking to their tutor, because they go, "Awww.." when I say it's the last song, and then I'll say,  "This is Ben who's gonna sing to you the next song. They're like "Wooo!!!"

Alex  

People were really invested in the music. They're quite quiet in between songs, but they will show their appreciation.

Simeon  

There's a lack of ego and amount of sincerity that just doesn't exist as much in Western culture. Crystal and I were talking about what the difference is between crowds in America and crowds in Asia. Americans  love to tell you about other cool gigs they've been to, and what what was really good about it, which is all very lovely things. But then Crystals, like, translating for us as people are coming up after the shows in Asia, and it's literally just, like, "Your music makes me happy." Just the most base level, heartwarming -There's no need to put on a front. 

Crystal  

"Your music suits the season."

Liam  

What's it been like having the music promoted so internationally, and preparing to be so far outside of the current scene within Aotearoa? 

Crystal  

It's been really exciting. For the Asia tour, for example, we don't even know these people at all. And then they'l come up to us, going, "Oh, I knew you from when you released the single 'Aseurai'". I haven't been to America personally, so I'm very stoked to find out what's out there as well - it'll be very big, I suppose. But I'm excited!

Simeon  

I definitely feel like the shows are the synthesis for understanding what that international stuff means, because we get sent reports on the internet, like clicking on another link, but when you go to the place, and the people are real, and they're lovely, they're really short.

Liam  

Is that about someone specific?

Simeon  

 That's about Michelle, Japanese Breakfast.

Simeon  

How did the Japanese Breakfast show feel?

Simeon  

That was the best I've been treated at one of those shows. Oftentimes with those international opening slots, they don't care what you do, either side of getting on or getting off stage. Whereas with this one we had so much time to sound check, and some things went wrong, and then their crew helped us out, and the whole thing was just part of a team.

Alex  

And Michelle came into our green room to say hi!

Alex  

And to smell the blue cheese in the charcuterie board. There was a big waft that went over her. 

Liam  

Going into the America tour, are you hoping for a focus around promoting the album, or also sharing and working on some new stuff?

Liam  

It'll be mostly album stuff

Simeon  

We have good analytics in America, although I hate to say it. That is, is a place that we have some amount of audience, more so than other places, at least as far Spotify tells us. 

Alex  

Ben's back in town just before the tour, so it would be nice to try and work on some new stuff. 

Crystal  

There are so many shows that we may get sick of our setlist and then try out new stuff

Alex  

Try an experimental ambient set.

Liam  

Have you put much thought towards what's next?

Crystal  

Yeah, we've had meetings and get togethers to try and talk about that, and we are very excited for album number two. We have had some little demos,  tons of writing, and some playthrough, but we're trying to just think about it a little bit harder. Album number one was quite organic, in a way - we didn't think about the album progression, start to finish, too hard - except for Simeon, who has gone. "I love the last song, I'm gonna write the last song." For album number two, we're thinking about it a little bit harder. 

Liam  

Not necessarily in a way that you didn't think about album one?

Alex  

No no no, It's just that since we recorded all that, we've played so many more shows, we've gotten to know each other more. I think there's more trust, and there's more openness, and this idea of four people collaborating on songs is like, such a limitless possibility. 

Simeon  

Really, the first album felt like a first date. It's a little bit tentative and you're not fully yourself, not for any particular reason. 

Alex  

That's a great first date!

Liam  

I do not hear that from the outside, it sound's very sure of itself. It's the first day of a happy marriage. 

Crystal  

Yeah, we all know that we like convenience store food

Simeon  

We can bond over missing Korea.

‘Aseurai’ is out now via Carpark Records in all good music stores. You can keep up to date with the band at @phoeberings.